Before Saturday’s game, a few positions/ players were the most written and talked about.
The offensive line is the most talked about, rightfully so, not because of who is making the roster but who will be starting.
After that group, there are four spots that have gotten major attention by both the writers and the fans. Even though that probably changed to 5 after Boyle’s dismal performance Saturday. But that’s a totally different discussion for another day.
Tight ends, Kuntz’s holding penalties at critical times Saturday must be a consideration in final 53 discussions. He is sort of like Ashtyn Davis, an excellent athlete who is a very unpolished player.
Running back, Knight sort of wrote his ticket off of the 53. Might be good though, teams might ignore him and he can learn on the PS. Even though Abanikanda’s injury might save him. Since we don’t know the severity of his injury.
It would be nice of both Gipson and Brownlee make the squad but presently the pick has to be Gipson. Saleh and coaches made a big deal about Mims’s lack of special teams experience as a deterrent to him playing more. Gipson’s punt return ability should be a roster maker. He had one chance Saturday and he returned it 31 yards. He can be a difference maker. The Pats purposely drafted a punt returner/ db in the third round last year and the Jets were the recipient of that pick in the infamous 10-3 loss at Foxboro. The game that probably help lead to the Rodgers acquisition, Zach’s NO game.
Lastly, based on Saleh’s post game comments that made Ashtyn Davis sound like the second coming of Ed Reed.
Who is the number 4 safety.
Are we to believe that Davis has finally figured out how to play the position. Or was it just by luck he had his best game as a pro on Saturday.
If numbers mean anything, he was involved in 7 total tackles. Dean had ten of which one was a special teams tackle that resulted in negative yardage.
Davis for the preseason 10 tackles, Dean 20.
Before anything is set in stone, have both players have equal time next week against the Giants. Let’s see who survives.
It's worth noting that Trey Dean doesn't, actually, fill the same role as Ashtyn Davis. Dean is a 100 percent box safety. Davis is backing up Tony Adams as the deep safety (free safety). Additionally, Davis plays on practically all of the specials. Also....why can't they keep 5 safeties? It sounds like there will be a bunch of 3 safety looks with Amos getting lots of big nickel reps.
You make a good point. With all the other issues to resolve, this one is rather minor, especially if the Jets have already made up their minds. It is what it is.
Good point but not entirely accurate. Dean has played more FS than Davis! As for keeping 5 S’s that might happen! I think there will be a lot of roster manipulation as there have been some injuries that will effect roster construction!
I was, actually, investigating some of this more and I think you're right! I think I'm going on what I was watching in the extremely limited sample size of preseason games. I saw Davis covering a deep third, a lot, and saw Dean prowling the box. I love the idea of keeping five guys, regardless of exact positional designation. I'm REALLY excited about the three safety sets with Adams, Amos, and Whitehead!
I think it would take a collapse of biblical proportions or a serious injury to have Dean get the nod over Davis after the last preseason game and I don't see that happening. I don't know if Davis has really progressed enough, but the team has made its feelings about it VERY well known. If the numbers work, I would definitely try to sneak Dean onto the PS. He does have some solid traits and could be a future regular.
Mike Z I under your thinking on this but a good organization will not make a determination on something like this based on one shining moment by a player who has done nothing over a 3 year period that’s says he is a viable option at his position!
Good morning Bobber, good post. It would be painful to watch the Hers trot out davis again. I have enjoyed watching Dean’s play thus far. True he has played the box more but has done a respectable job as a deep safety.
David, Good morning sir. Great article as always. Some quick thoughts on your takes if you will, the whole “we didn’t have a lot of plays” comment from our very own Mr.Rogers” aka Robert ( milk toast) Saleh is interesting. While it points to the obvious as the amount of plays on offense was relatively low, it also points to the not so great QB play. Indigo 394 had some interesting comments here today. A lot of which I agree with. The whole Aaron Rodgers is gonna save Zach Wilson thing is hysterical. Zach’s play yesterday is a continuation of what we have seen since he returned from his injury his rookie season. A keep it simple dummed down overly conservative game plan designed to give him easy throws to build his confidence. It’s his 3rd freak’s season. Good QB play is all about being confident. At this stage in his career If you need to build your confidence your in the wrong profession. The lack of offensive plays is a result of Wilson and Boyle not being trusted to throw the ball down the field. They are being tasked to “just don’t screw it up” job titles. You can’t win football games at this level with that type of offensive strategy. As far as I recall the only two passes Zach has thrown in 3 halves of football that traveled 10 or more yards down field happened in week one vs. Cleveland. Everything is at or behind the line of scrimmage. One the bright side Mekhi looks like the obvious choice at RT. He looked like the guy we saw three years ago. It’s a big if but if he can stay healthy? Ashtyn Davis made a few highlight reel plays. But, does that negate 3 years of basically nothing on defense? I still think Deane gives us better bang for the buck and as Bobber pointed out on AD’s best day Dean dis as much or more minus the so,ash plays. Interesting note, on that one pass block video you posted the guy Becton destroyed was our old friend Hamsa Nasireldeen who we cut a week or so ago. 😂. That must have been a fun post game chat between those two.....😂
Good morning! Agree with your assessments on Zach and Davis. We really do not have a backup QB that meets the standard of mediocrity. Would be upset if Dean doesn’t make the 53 as I think he has played well enough to do so. Not sure he can make it to the practice squad!
We'll certainly see! I hope he is on the team, somehow. I think we, as fans, overrate our own dudes when it comes to what the rest of the league may think. Part of having a good roster, however, is making these tough decisions and having the bottom of your roster pillaged each year.
Certainly a player can see the “light” in his 3rd year but historically Davis’ angles and tackling has been atrocious. It would be painful to have to watch an encore of the prior two years.
Michael R, I’m with you on this one! Fool me once shame on you.... after three years of showing nothing as a position player I’m looking at Saturday night as an aberration! You can’t base a decision on one shinning moment!
Daniel yeah, we’ve all heard all the special teams stuff and it is important. But we all also know guys get hurt. So you need to feel good about who you have to fill in.? Davis has not been very good when asked to fill in. The areas of weakness are well documented so if we know I’m pretty sure the bad guys know too! If we keep 5 there that’s cool. Among the things we tend to under appreciate is the fact that while Davis had his best game as a Jet with 7 tackles Dean actually had 10! 😂
To answer your question about negating three years of basically nothing on defense: yes. I'm probably overkilling it with my responses on ole Ashtyn on this thread, but he, actually, has earned his spot on specials, and plays A TON there. Additionally, they play very different roles. It's possible they're fighting for a roster spot, but comparing their play isn't quite an apples to apples comparison. Dean, however, HAS been good and deserves a spot. Keep him on the roster and keep 5 safeties.
what he's done before really doesn't mean anything, imo. It's what the coaches see in him now and his contributions now.
The Jets seemingly play a lot of 3-safety looks. It seems like 5 safeties is needed if that's used often.
I was squarely in the "Davis Sucks!" camp. But he seems to be bigger and better than I remember. And it's not like we have all-pros at the position. ANYONE playing better than the last 2 years of safeties is welcome. If Davis can be part of that equation, keep him.
Has there been a weirder feeling than watching a game end in a 13-6 loss but coming out feeling really good about it? I thought the offensive line was excellent. The protection was great until late when the likes of Chris Glaser, Adam Pankey, Brett Laing, and Grant Hermanns were doing the protecting. Even then, there were some good reps those fellas put on tape. There was a lot to be enthused about and I think we're starting to see what the plan might be for opening day.
Mekhi Becton might be positioning himself to be named the starter at right tackle. He put some great reps on tape and was pretty flawless. He looked healthy and unencumbered. He didn't look like he was doing any thinking, which was nice. He also put some syrup on that pancake, which you love to see.
Max Mitchell put together a pretty damn good performance in the first half at left tackle. There were a couple of instances of him overextending himself, but I loved the rest of what I saw. Those overextensions resulted in him falling off of his block and totally ruined the play, but the rest of his reps showed that those are correctable moments. His pass sets looked solid as hell and he was getting out there and running on the edge.
I think Becton's performance on the right side might mean the coaching staff is trying to play the odds, here. They're best off if Mekhi is starting on opening day, but they're also best off if Duane Brown is, also, starting. The best way to make sure that happens is getting Mekhi to get comfy on the right side and permanently move Max to the left side to be the "just in case" scenario if Duane isn't ready to roll for that first game. It, also, would allow each of our young tackles to stick to one side of the line and get comfortable. It, also, means Turner becomes the swing tackle and sometimes fill-in at guard that he was, probably, signed to be. I, actually, am very encouraged by all of this.
I thought it was also REALLY telling that they gave Joe Tippman the start at left guard, considering we saw his first work at guard earlier in the week at right guard. It's a moot point if he's out for any extended time, but that was interesting that they trusted him to move around that much. That's huge!
Finally, and much less importantly, I think Irwin Charles may have sealed his fate by, AGAIN, hearing footsteps and failing to make a catch as a result. It was a bad day for former Penn State transfers.
Agree with your assessment. Becton looked good and since the Jets have pencilled Brown as LT when he returns, the right side is his spot. I must say he looked good manhandling anyone in front of him!
AVT, Becton and Jeremy Ruckert at TE, Jets run right all day long. Over the moon that Mekhi has embraced the Right Tackle position, seems to be a seamless transition from Left Tackle ( really ?), great athleticism. Could the Offensive line become a Strength ? AVT & Becton duo can make you dream. Ashtyn Davis making the 53 ? Please. Barely played a snap on defense last year, 2.7 against the CAP. Dean had a better camp. The Tampa Bay game , was Ashtyn unleashed, his best game as a Jet, put out some great tape, but not a believer.
JO, totally agree on Davis. Keeping him on this roster based on his one shinning moment would be so Jet like! Saleh has his favorites and I think that’s detrimental to building a solid roster.
I think that happens (coaches keeping a favorite over a better player, or using a favorite player instead of a better player who stays glued to the bench) a lot more in the NFL than we realize. Coaches are human, and their feelings and relationship can't help but color their perspectives and decisions. It takes a very self aware Coach to realize that he's allowing his personal feelings to influence his decisions to the detriment of the team, and then go against those feelings.
I’m listening to Bobber, let them fight it out playing against the Giants. Great point on favorites, Salah’s favorable comment on Davis are troubling. Bye the way , I always blamed the Special Team Coach for lobbying for Ashtyn
Well it makes sense that the STs Coach is going to lobby for who he feels are the best STs players. Better players makes him look better and keeps him employed.
Do we fans, perhaps, undervalue special teams play? I understand the thought process regarding folks wanting Trey Dean to make the roster over Ashtyn Davis. Dean is younger, Davis hasn't produced on defense (although, he has on specials), and Davis costs a lot more. I think cost, first and foremost, is a red herring. Aaron Rodgers gave up money so the Jets could put together a competitive team this year. It's also worth noting that we already pay a specials only player in the millions, and we love him for it (Hardee). I think there may be a little bit fan bias in the sense that we, as fans, don't often get to see the innards of the special teams, so we don't appreciate when a guy is important in that respect.
I, actually, think the Jets keep 5 safeties, for what it's worth. Ashtyn and Trey don't even play the same position. Ashtyn is a true free safety and Trey is about as box safety as it gets.
If Surrat is healthy, I think they're more likely to keep 5 LBs than 5 Safeties. For that matter, they're probably more likely to keep 6 CBs and 4 Safeties, than 5 CBs and 5 Safeties. I could be wrong of course. With their having so many good TEs, and with Brownlee and Gipson, if they plan to keep Kuntz on the roster, that will take away the 5th S or 5th LB or 6th CB. If they keep Bawden, that will take away another player at another position.
That's why it hurts so much that Jarrick Bernard-Converse is gonna wind up on IR and hasn't taken a snap for the Jets. He can play FS or CB and could have saved a roster spot.
Daniel, I agree with all that you say except for keeping 5 safeties and the bit about Ashtyn being a true FS. I don't see any way that the Jets can keep 5 safeties. The numbers are just too tight.
In the past Saleh has said that Ashtyn is more of an in-the-box SS. His speed and athleticism suggest that he would be a FS, but his mental makeup and skills, limit him more to being a SS.
He, certainly, has the physical make-up of a free safety. He's the kind of dude who was so raw coming out that I'm sure Douglas saw him as a bit of a blank canvas. It's possible that the defensive staff has been trying to make that a thing the last year and change. I agree that Surratt is worth a roster spot, but it's possible that they see more value in keeping Dean around to provide big nickel reps than keeping Surratt to not be a primary back-up (because it certainly seems like Sherwood backs up CJ Mosley AND has the role of starting WILL given that they really don't start a 3rd linebacker). The defense has such an intriguing roster construction.
Very good rundown David, as usual. For me the biggest things to talk about after this game are the injuries to Tippmann and Izzy. Not hearing anything from the team other than "tests have to be done and evaluated" makes me lean towards being more serious than not. I guess we will hear something either late today or tomorrow morning and that will be the determining factor on what happens 8 days from today. Becton looked quite good and barring any injury recurrence I feel he will be starting at RT on opening day. Not hearing virtually any word regarding Duane Brown makes me think he will not be ready for the first couple of games. I don't know if they will move Becton back to LT if that's the case, but when there is no news coming out of the team of any sort you just have to wait. I made my opinion on the Dean/Davis deal in a response to Bobber and what's going to happen is going to happen and all the noise about it is moot at this point. I'm really wondering about Corey Davis, he seems to be a nonentity at this point and no real news about him about anything. Either way, it's either going to be Brownlee and Gipson, or just Gipson. I also haven't heard about what's going on with Ruckert's, AVT's and Lawson's injuries. Anybody heard any updates ?
As far as ZW is concerned, the team is committed to him as the backup this season, and that's that. It definitely will be his last shot in my opinion and I highly doubt they will pick up his fifth-year option. What's really scary is The Frightener, Tim Boyle. He shows absolutely nothing of value to me. I'd be afraid to send him in even for a kneel-down, he looked so awful. And his throwing motion seems to be just loft it up there and hope for the best. I guess we'll see what shakes out this week and the final exam comes against the Giants. Now I'm going to go over to GGN and see what nonsense is there today, lol.
I don't know whether moving Becton around is, necessarily, a good idea. I suppose you have to consider the value in, possibly, getting a slight boost at left tackle as opposed to right tackle. It makes more sense to leave him where he is and let him get comfortable with that knee. It isn't like there's actual evidence that left tackle is any more important than right tackle. The blind side was a fun book, but it wasn't trying to tell us that left tackle IS the more important position. It was telling us that teams VIEWED it as the more important position. Defenses change up their pressure packages, move dudes around, and change where pressure is coming from, and offenses are rarely going to leave a guy out on an island completely isolated in man-on-man protection. You might as well start Mitchell or Turner (I prefer Mitchell).
I was just spitballin'. Becton looked very good and let's see how it goes against the Giants. RT might just be the perfect spot for him. I agree with you about Billy Turnstile, if anyone is going to start at LT if Brown isn't ready, it should by Mitchell. Greg Senat has played pretty well, but he's no starter. I personally think they should sign Risner if the deal is right. It might be the best move to make regarding the o-line and would really lock down the guard position and make any potential AVT move to tackle easier to implement.
I would've agreed regarding Risner if we were back in May or June. We're in the last week of training camp, though, and it isn't like they're expecting Duane Brown to be more than a week or two out. Risner would be a guy you have to get up to speed, get into playing shape, work into the offensive line room, work into the starting unit, and get comfortable with all of that in the next two weeks. I'd just as soon take Mitchell or Turner for a week than rolling the dice on all of that uncertainty.
That's all you can do, honestly. That's, technically, all the front office can do, at some point. Douglas had his hands full last offseason when EVERYBODY on the offensive line got hurt. Thank goodness we no longer have to rely on Conor McDermott anymore.
It's not the last week of TC. There are 2 1/2 to 3 weeks left in TC. Of course it would have been better to bring Risner in then, but I'd rather bring him in now than not at all. That said, I don't think the Jets will bring him in.
I don't see them bringing anybody new in. This group is the group. Becton sure seems like he's going to get more 1st team reps at right tackle this week. Hopefully they're ONLY at right tackle.
Daniel, please understand I am not dismissing your thinking on the mental side of playing the QB position. Been there done that. Started playing as an 8 year old! Was blessed to have arm talent and put at the QB position until my Jr year in college. Tore my rotator cuff as a soph so I switched to WR/TE! Coached HS fb for 30 years. Based on my experience there and having a former coaching colleague who ended up as a GM for two NFL teams I think I have a pretty good idea of what the expectations should be for successful QB play at this highest level! I don’t claim to have all the answers but I do know that if it looks like a duck and it quacks like a duck the chances are pretty good that it’s a duck! The Jets just brought in an 🦅 Eagle to fix the mess we made two years ago picking ZW! So duck season is now officially over for me 😂🤣
I truly appreciate the nuanced response and I can, definitely, admit that I got up in my feelings with my post 😅😅
You’re definitely correct that Zach has showcased very little in terms of an ability to cope with the mental rigors of the game. I think there are a number of reasons for that, some of which were out of his control, but everybody deals with those, and if you don’t, you’re outta luck. I think Zach is out of the door at some point in the next year and change. I don’t see him improving enough and think a lot of this is building up his value so they can try to get SOME compensation for him. I think we’re, actually, on the same page here. 😅
Sorry, Daniel, but I totally disagree. IMO it doesn't make any sense at all to put Mitchell or Turner at LT. That's asking (begging, actually) to get Rodgers seriously injured and on IR for much, if not the rest, of the season. Becton is showing that he's comfortable with the knee now. The difference between Becton and Turner or Mitchell at LT isn't "slight." There's a huge difference between Becton's level of play and what we have seen from Turner and Mitchell so far. If Brown isn't ready to go, then by all means, Becton should move back to LT. As you know, he's been taking snaps there until this week, so he would have no problems going back to LT. They can then use Turner at RT or move AVT to RT until Brown is ready to go, then they can move Becton back to RT and AVT back to RG. Mitchell is not ready to start or play in the NFL imo. He should be glued to the bench.
You can't be serious with that LT isn't more important than RT statement! IMO that is utter nonsense. Protecting the QB's blind side is of much greater importance in keeping the QB healthy and able to play without worrying about getting crushed from behind. It enables the QB to relax and play when he trusts that his blindside is well protected. Yes, defenses change and send their best pass rushers against the RT at times, but the QB can see that and adjust and there are things that the OC can do to compensate for that. QBs don't have eyes in the back of their heads, and they need to know that their blindside is safe.
Craig, there’s one problem with you thinking on this. It’s the trust factor! We all know Becton is the most talented player on our o-line. But availability is your best availability! RS would be insane to totally trust him! I hope he earns his way on the field! No question he’s our best option.
Ron, Saleh has admitted that he hasn't trusted Becton in a long time. Becton should have earned his trust this TC. He is healthy, he is strong, and he is dominating the LOS. He IS available. Not starting Becton is a fear-based move. That's what's behind the lack of trust. Little is ever gained by making decisions based on fear. IMO it makes zero sense to start an inferior player knowing that the team will not play as well with that player in the starting lineup. You go with your best players, and if Becton winds up getting hurt again at some point, then at least you've gotten great play from him up until that point, and then you make the change. Sure, there would be an adjustment at that point, but the difference between Becton starting and Mitchell or Turner starting could be several more wins than they would have had with Mitchell or Turner starting. That could be the difference between making the playoffs and not making the playoffs. Saleh makes too many decisions based on his personal feelings about players. IMO Becton has done enough already to earn his way onto the field and to earn Saleh's trust.
I think your anti-Saleh bias is shining through, buddy. There's zero evidence he feels some sort of way, personally, about Mekhi Becton. Give that a rest. Becton will probably wind up starting at some point. That sort of looks like it has been the plan the whole time. There is WAY more going on behind the scenes than you're making it out to be.
Daniel, I have no bias against Saleh. I like him and want to trust him, but it's the words that come out of his mouth and the decisions that he has made that I think are wrong, that causes a degree of distrust. We all see what we want to see. Perhaps I'm seeing things you aren't because you are a former coach and are biased in Saleh's favor or maybe you did some of the same things that I've said I don't like.
I'm sorry, but I'm not giving anything a rest just because you disagree, and it's not your place to tell me what or how to think or post. I think there's plenty of evidence that Saleh allows his personal feelings about players to influence his decisions. He doesn't have to be necessarily biased against Becton, it could just be that he is biased for Mitchell. It isn't just the Becton situation that makes me think that Saleh allows his feelings to get in the way with personnel decisions. There's A. Davis. Maybe C. Davis. Of course there is probably more going on behind the scenes than we know. We only know what they allow us to know, what leaks out, or when they slip up and admit something in a press conference. I'm not making anything out about what goes on behind the scenes. That's your interpretation.
He's, without a doubt, the most talented player on the offensive line. He might be the most talented guy on either side of the line, defense or offense. You're very right, though....the talent has never been his issue. It's been one of the best kinds of ability: AVAILability.
Mitchell looked good on Saturday. Not sure what game you were watching. Moving guys around is the way you wind up with miscommunication. And I'm very serious. There is literally zero truth to the nonsense about left tackles being more important than right tackles because of handedness. That isn't remotely how the position is played or coached and coaches do not take that into account. I'm actually telling you this from relatively recent experience. It isn't a thing.
Sorry, but I think you are overstating things. I know that that the gap has closed between the two, but don't think it has closed entirely, at least not in the minds of QBs. I'm not a betting man, but if I were, I'd bet you that any NFL QB would tell you that there is a difference and that it matters to them. I don't care what coaches say. They aren't always right. We've seen more than our share of coaches with cockamamie ideas on the Jets. For southpaw QBs, the RT is the more important position. If the two were equal, Wirfs wouldn't be getting moved from RT to LT. That puts the lie to your theory.
I checked out the Buccaneers depth chart and the reasoning behind his move. The guy they wanted at right tackle, Luke Goedeke played ONLY right tackle at Central Michigan and they spent a 2nd rounder on him. I imagine they felt more comfortable asking the veteran, in Wirfs, to make the move to a different side of the line. That, honestly, falls in line with some of what we're dealing with here. It's a sliding scale, of course. They don't want to ask Duane Brown to move, but they will ask Mekhi, Max, and Billy to move. It's all in the details. Duane has played every single snap for the last 16 years (probably more....he probably started a bunch in college) at left tackle, Billy has played all over the place, Mekhi had been moved around the previous season and there's definitely an explicit plan in place for how they're handling him, and Max played on both sides in college. There was less to unlearn for the three younger guys.
I understand that some of the logic works. And I understand that there are some anecdotes that can prove the rule. What I'm telling you, however, is that it is, yes, overstated, and that quarterbacks just aren't fretting whether they have a better right tackle or left tackle. The whole conceit of left tackle being more important isn't borne out by how offenses or defenses are called. It just doesn't work that way.
Mike, it remains to be seen what happens with Zach. I agree that they won't agree to the original 5th year that he was due, as that's too much money for him to be the backup QB. They may seek to get him to sign an extension that is incentive-laden and has escalators built in for performance and number of games played that would increase the length and value of the contract. IMO it would be in both his and the team's best interests to stay. He would continue developing under Rodgers and Hackett, and feeling more and more comfortable in the WCO. In addition he already has chemistry with his receivers and the CS. The Jets aren't going to be in a position to draft another FQB prospect for a number of years, and the chance of their getting another veteran QB like Rodgers are slim and none. They'd be forced to go with journeyman jags at QB, and wouldn't have much of a chance of going anywhere in the playoffs. If he develops, the way I think he will, Zach will give them the best chance of continued success and getting high level QB play. Rodgers thinks so as well.
Many fans don't realize how complex and difficult the WCO is for QBs. I think it is probably the most difficult for QBs. It has so many requirements of the QB. I've read that it takes at least 3 years to really learn the scheme, and that's if one has good coaching. We know that Zach had bad coaching his 1st two seasons, and that's part of the reason he struggled so.
We all obsess about roster construction but in the end the team decides. I do worry in the event of injury to AR, our backups don’t even meet the definition of mediocre!
Craig, I give you credit for your loyalty but as you can by the comments here obviously most Jet fans have seen enough of Zach to know he’s not a viable option at this time! The Jets are trying to promote him as an option but they are killing any shot he has by not allowing him to actually show what he can ( or can’t do?) David has discussed his struggles under pressure ad nauseam! The fact he’s been the league’s lowest rated QB his first two seasons is literally unprecedented! It’s never happened in league history.
Ron, there are first times for everything. I could care less what most Jets fans think. Most Jets fans are impatient, and have little understanding of what it is like to play in the NFL, what it takes to make wholesale changes in one's technique and mental approach to the game, and the difference that coaching can make. I don't expect that you or anyone will change his mind, but I'm going to share a post (if it works) that I found on another Jets football site last night that is excellent in showing one very valid reason Zach has struggled so badly the last two seasons.
I think at the tender age of 71 I have a pretty idea of what Zach’s issues have been so thanks but no thanks. I have played the game and have extensive experience as a coach. The Zach fan has an endless line of reasons or excuses for Zach’s failings and frankly the only one that holds water is David’s post from a few months ago about his inability to throw under pressure. The just breaks down under duress. The happy feet put him in poor throwing position which affects his accuracy and the timing in the play. He misses his windows dancing around. He’s not the first NFL QB to have this problem. Honestly I can’t think of one that ever fixed it?
He is going to be the backup QB this year. Ultimately the proof is in the pudding. If he gets to play we will be able to assess if he has made any progress. He has arm talent but his feel for the game and what is between the ears matters as well. Progress in those areas will determine his success… half empty or half full?
Whether it's half empty or half full depends upon the perspective of the viewer, and in general, people see what they want to see, especially if they have a bias one way or the other. For those who have decided that Zach is a bust and never can become a good QB, all they see are his mistakes. They don't see any growth or improvement. In a very real sense, they don't want to see it, because that goes against their agenda, and many, if not most fans would rather be right than be wrong so they look more knowledgeable. I only want what's best for the team, and am all too happy to admit when I am wrong. None of us are experts, and our egos get too much involved.
I view ZW via the sum of his prior performances. Can he improve, of coarse. Will he improve to the extent that he can become a competent starting QB? That story has not been written. Frankly as the Jets invested a number 2 pick on him, I would prefer and would be ecstatic if he does succeed as opposed to being a work of fiction.
I was at the game Saturday night. Why was it after about a quarter and a 1/2 did it feel like the same old Jets. I hated losing to Todd Bowles and looking at the preseason standings with the Jets in the normal residence - last place.
Three games in and there are wayyyy too many penalties. It never changes on a Saleh coached team for some reason. It wasnt how many they got called for (and they always take a ton) its when they occured. Then the turnovers. I did not see anything glaring by whatever mongrel combinatuon of offensice linemen were out there. (I get they looking to solidify the roster).
The defense seemed to be in a bend dont break mode but even with the pass rush a 2nd rate QB was picking up yards and 1st downs keeping the Jets offense on the bench more of the night. I really wish they had signed Bridgewater as 'we' are in toruble in Rogers goes down. I was never for Boyle being even the 3rd string.
Oh ya - we didnt make it through the preseason with out a key injury - in this case two of them. Assume the worse as there has been no updates at all. Th einfamous Brown injury that never goes away means going into week 1 there will be a offensive line - again that never played together. Good news is the Bills seem to have thier own issues on offense line.
I think I'm becoming the Pollyanna on this thread. I'm not all that worked up with most of the penalties given the context. Two were Zach Kuntz holding, and we understand that the dude is still learning how to block. That isn't one of those "these guys are undisciplined" penalties. Same goes for one of Langford's penalties. The one I'd be concerned with was Langford going head hunting on his other penalty. There weren't a bunch of false starts, delay of games, roughing the passer/unnecessary roughness (aside from Langford's aforementioned) penalties. I would, however, not be surprised to see some penalties like that late in a preseason game, given that most of the guys playing are 3rd and 4th stringers who know very little of the scheme and are playing for a spot. Things get sloppy and people get hurt. The "Saleh is coddling" narrative is kind of old and doesn't ring true.
I didnt say he is coddling i am saying a "Saleh coached team is laced with penalty taking - be it the 1.s, 2's 3s, 4s - Agree=ts preseason but regular season with different players and its always a ton of penanlities -
We might have been watching different teams. The types of penalties point is still valid, however. Are you suggesting that they're an undisciplined team? Are you suggesting that they're poorly coached? Is it an offensive thing? Is it a defensive thing? Is it technique? Is it corners getting too grabby? Is it defensive players getting lots of unnecessary roughness calls? Or are we, perhaps, talking about delay of game penalties? False starts? Holding? Are you differentiating between all of this? And I understand that you didn't explicitly say, verbatim, that Saleh is coddling players. That is the narrative, though. I think that narrative is invented out of whole cloth by a fanbase that expects the worst and turns on it's own with alarming speed.
no no no I think Saleh is one of the best coaches the Jets have ever had and im a 55 year fan. Not sure where that narrative is coming from and i never heard it to be honest with you. As a season ticket holder and being at the games - i shouldn't have to wait 3 seconds to celebrate a good play or look back on the field for a flag. I am not differentiating anything - I'm saying on a 45 man roster (now its 90) its thru the whole team no matter the position, group, whatever. My first point written is exactly what you just said: I was giong into the season NOT excpecting the worse - for once. It sure "felt" like with the injuries and the penalties it will be the worse as per usual. I dont really know but after all these years can something change please.
I totally feel that feeling of waiting for the team to finally stop making the same mistakes. That's why I've been so happy to have Saleh and Douglas around. I never actually liked Rex Ryan. The guy was a huge asshole and was almost assuredly trying to cover some of own perceived self-perception issues with all of the bravado. Gase was, just, the worst. Then they go and sign that huge dickhead Gregg Williams, and it was just SOOOOOO hard to root for those teams with those guys in charge. Finally, they bring in a coach who is positive, likeable, and seems competent. Those Gase/Williams years sucked something fierce.
Great newsletter today, David! I love everything about it, from the content to the layout!
I really hope that Tippman's and Abanikanda's injuries are minor and won't be season-ending!!!!! We really need both of them to play this season. Hopefully, they won't miss much time, and hopefully AVT, Tomlinson, and Brown will all be back this week, and Saleh will wise up, and move Becton up to taking reps with the 1s so our starting OL can start working together!
I'm so excited for Becton, and in turn for the Jets, because Becton is going to make our OL a lot better. I'm also very happy for him that he has the chance to silence the NY media and all the Jets fans who were on his case and wanting him gone. I hope he has an All Pro season, and the Jets sign him to a long-term contract.
You gotta love our pass rush, and we know our secondary is going to be tight and even better with Tony Adams back there.
The only area where there is a big question mark is the middle of the field where LBs will have to cover TEs and RBs. Hopefully Sherwood can get it done, or if Surratt makes the roster, he can. If so, we could definitely challenge Dallas for the #1 D this season.
Zach is making definite progress, and his comments that you shared in the Post-Game Quotes help me to understand better what's been going on with Zach. There are two of them. One, by his own admission, he is hard on himself. He expects himself to play better, and he has been unable to move on from a bad play. That causes a player to think too much, makes them uptight, and increases the likelihood that they will repeat that mistake or make another mistake. In addition, I have read that MLF was very negative and critical in how he handled players. If that's true, it's no wonder Zach lost his confidence and played so badly last season. Zach needed someone like Hackett, who is upbeat and positive, to help him move on from his mistakes and to have fun, and not beat himself up for mistakes. He also need Rodgers tips on fundamentals and the nuances of playing the QB position in the WCO.
The second insight is that for the last two seasons Zach has evidently been trying to run an offense that he really didn't understand why they were doing things, what the goal was for certain plays. It's no wonder he didn't show command of the offense and struggled, on top of the other reasons. That's the OC's and QB Coach's job is to communicate those things to the QB. It's not just a matter of "Do this how and when I tell you, you don't need to understand why." MLF is even a bigger moron than I already thought he was. His big brother needs to get a hold of him and teach him how to be a coach.
I think those two things coming to light explain why Zach struggled so, was so inconsistent, and why he is not improving pretty quickly. It gives me even greater confidence that is why that JD and Saleh haven't given up on him, and that he is still in the Jets' plans long term.
I don't see the Jets getting rid of Corey Davis to keep Brownlee or Gipson. That would be a very questionable, risky, and perhaps stupid move in a season where they have SB aspirations. Davis is an experienced player, a quality player, and great scheme fit. He helps both our passing and rushing attacks. It might be one thing to trade or cut him if we needed the cap space or if we had a 2nd or 3rd round WR pick that we needed to make room for, but it's quite another to do that for a UDFA who could wind up being another David Clowney. While I would hate to lose Brownlee or Gipson, I don't see any way we can keep both, and we may not even be able to keep one of them.
I'm sorry, CGVet, but it definitely looks like A. Davis is still going to be on the roster, and if Saturday night's game is any indication, that might not be a bad thing. Evidently, he's very good on STs, and he looked good on the field on D.
I don't see any way that Kuntz can or should make the roster. If another team claims him off waivers, then so be it. He is not ready to play in the NFL. He has a ton of potential, but you can't use a precious roster spot on a player who only has potential and won't be able to contribute this season over another player who is already playing in a consistent, reliable solid fashion.
I hope that Bam and Dye can make it to the PS and that Bawden will join them there.
You're spot on with Zach and the mental stuff he's working through. I really like Hackett. I was a little unsure of him, but I think that was more tied into my negativity about Aaron Rodgers than anything. He seems like this relentlessly upbeat fella that totally vibes with Saleh, and is a great counterpoint to Ulbrich. Having Aaron Rodgers in the room doesn't suck, either.
You've got in right regarding Corey Davis. He's going to be important at some point this season, whether it is excellent run blocking, a chance big play, or helping our younger fellas with the trials and tribulations of acclimating to the league. He's valuable and Rodgers took that pay cut for a reason.
Kuntz just does not look like a football player, yet. Guys have transformed before, of course. It's concerning that when he runs, he doesn't look as athletic as he's supposed to be. It's also concerning that he looks afraid of contact. He could've used the experience of staying at Penn State and working his way into playing time.
Bam and Dye made some big ole mistakes on Saturday night. Hopefully one or both can make it to the practice squad.
Daniel Mcsparin, yeah, sorry but I’m not buying any of the mental stuff with Zach’s. It’s year three and we’re still talking about him like he’s a rookie? All the other like, dislike stuff aside none of this matters. With Rodgers back next season and very likely in 2025 Zach has no future here! Any player with any ambition or pride is not gonna want to spend the next three years appreciating for Aaron Rodgers. Even if JD wanted to pick up his 20 million option it would be financially impossible! My guess is he will move on next offseason! I believe that’s in his best interests and that JD Will happily agree!
I agree that he probably doesn't have a future on the Jets. That doesn't make the mental process any less true. Football is an extremely mental game, and if you truly don't think that building up confidence again matters, I'm not sure what to tell you. It's a FACT of the game. When was the last time you played competitive football? Coached it? Ruined confidence is real, and it requires work to come back from it. If your argument is that they just need to cut bait and move on, there's probably a discussion around that. He's an asset that they invested lots of resources in, so it makes sense that they'd try to fix the mistakes they made. Please, engage with the actual conversation, dude.
I just can't stand ZW: What's with all the talk about the importance of his being Happy and Smiling.
He makes Mims (RIP) seem a genius. That run was almost identical to last years pre-season injury inducing scamp. On a drop back his feet are tapping faster than Sammy Davis Junior. Less smiling more stepping up into the pocket! How many times have you seen him on the bench with team mates? When we he release faster and lead his receiver? And that smirk, that smirk!
I'm a little bit less offended about him getting his mind right. I think that's part of him regaining his confidence and rebuilding his skillset. You are correct, however, in pointing out that he isn't stepping up into the pocket. I saw at least one play where a good starter steps up into the crease of the pocket when he's pressured. Zach did the same falling away, back-foot throw that has been his Achilles Heel. He needs to fix that, because protection was excellent on Saturday.
Daniel, please, stop with this whole confidence stuff. Playing the QB position is an Alpha requirement! At this stage in his career ( year 3) if he needs a pep talk or special catering he’s done! I have never heard of an NFL QB overcoming two horrendous seasons like Wilson has had! He’s had the benefit of far more surrounding talent and much better coaching and yet his numbers are far worse than his predecessors! My biggest regret with the Wilson pick is we could hav picked Penea Sewell, Kyle Pitts or Jamar Chase! Could have rolled with Sam and figured it out from there!
My guy; I agree that picking him was a mistake. I would've preferred Sewell. You're dismissing the very real loss of confidence, however, and the need to build it back. You don't need to try so hard to shit all over the guy to make your point that the pick didn't work out. In addition to that, you are, actually, flat out wrong that "this confidence stuff" isn't real. It's a real thing in athletics, regardless of the sport.
It wasn't on the two plays where he ran. On both of those the pocket was collapsing and he couldn't step up. I think there was one other throw where he couldn't step up either, but may be mistaken about that.
There was one where the pocket started to collapse and Zach kept drifting back, but the offensive line and the running back wound up cleaning it up. It was a half slide where the running back slotted right into the right side A gap and, technically, picked up the pressure, a bit. It looked like the running back was going to get pushed back into Zach but Schweitzer came in and cleaned up the pocket, providing a nice little place for him to step up into. It's the kind of thing where a seasoned and GOOD QB will stay calm and step up. That asshat Tom Brady would've done it. Rodgers would've, too.
I think Zach will once he is feeling more comfortable and confident. Growth isn't always linear, and it takes time. Zach obviously didn't get very good coaching at BYU or his first two seasons with the Jets. He has a ton of talent, but he is learning how to play QB in the NFL and in a very complex, rigid offense in terms of what the QB must do. That is all new to him. With his desire to learn and be as great as he can be, I have to believe that he will get there.
So today was an awesome day on this page! My feeling is our boy DWH is becoming a rock star. There are 89 comments on todays post. That’s amazing. The best part of this is there zero posts that have any vitriol or harsh language. That not something we should we should stuff off. It’s is not the norm on most Jet pages. It speaks to the maturity and civility on David’s page!
Before Saturday’s game, a few positions/ players were the most written and talked about.
The offensive line is the most talked about, rightfully so, not because of who is making the roster but who will be starting.
After that group, there are four spots that have gotten major attention by both the writers and the fans. Even though that probably changed to 5 after Boyle’s dismal performance Saturday. But that’s a totally different discussion for another day.
Tight ends, Kuntz’s holding penalties at critical times Saturday must be a consideration in final 53 discussions. He is sort of like Ashtyn Davis, an excellent athlete who is a very unpolished player.
Running back, Knight sort of wrote his ticket off of the 53. Might be good though, teams might ignore him and he can learn on the PS. Even though Abanikanda’s injury might save him. Since we don’t know the severity of his injury.
It would be nice of both Gipson and Brownlee make the squad but presently the pick has to be Gipson. Saleh and coaches made a big deal about Mims’s lack of special teams experience as a deterrent to him playing more. Gipson’s punt return ability should be a roster maker. He had one chance Saturday and he returned it 31 yards. He can be a difference maker. The Pats purposely drafted a punt returner/ db in the third round last year and the Jets were the recipient of that pick in the infamous 10-3 loss at Foxboro. The game that probably help lead to the Rodgers acquisition, Zach’s NO game.
Lastly, based on Saleh’s post game comments that made Ashtyn Davis sound like the second coming of Ed Reed.
Who is the number 4 safety.
Are we to believe that Davis has finally figured out how to play the position. Or was it just by luck he had his best game as a pro on Saturday.
If numbers mean anything, he was involved in 7 total tackles. Dean had ten of which one was a special teams tackle that resulted in negative yardage.
Davis for the preseason 10 tackles, Dean 20.
Before anything is set in stone, have both players have equal time next week against the Giants. Let’s see who survives.
That’s it, time to go get a godd.. snack.
It's worth noting that Trey Dean doesn't, actually, fill the same role as Ashtyn Davis. Dean is a 100 percent box safety. Davis is backing up Tony Adams as the deep safety (free safety). Additionally, Davis plays on practically all of the specials. Also....why can't they keep 5 safeties? It sounds like there will be a bunch of 3 safety looks with Amos getting lots of big nickel reps.
You make a good point. With all the other issues to resolve, this one is rather minor, especially if the Jets have already made up their minds. It is what it is.
Good point but not entirely accurate. Dean has played more FS than Davis! As for keeping 5 S’s that might happen! I think there will be a lot of roster manipulation as there have been some injuries that will effect roster construction!
I was, actually, investigating some of this more and I think you're right! I think I'm going on what I was watching in the extremely limited sample size of preseason games. I saw Davis covering a deep third, a lot, and saw Dean prowling the box. I love the idea of keeping five guys, regardless of exact positional designation. I'm REALLY excited about the three safety sets with Adams, Amos, and Whitehead!
Adams, Amos, and Whitehead sounds like a law firm! LOL
Excellent point. ...10 DL, 4 linebackers, 5 Safeties, 5 CB’s
I think it would take a collapse of biblical proportions or a serious injury to have Dean get the nod over Davis after the last preseason game and I don't see that happening. I don't know if Davis has really progressed enough, but the team has made its feelings about it VERY well known. If the numbers work, I would definitely try to sneak Dean onto the PS. He does have some solid traits and could be a future regular.
I doubt he would make the PS, I’m sure 10 tackles Saturday woke Bowles up considering Dean went to the University of Florida
You're right, that does make sense..........sighhhhhhhh !
Mike Z I under your thinking on this but a good organization will not make a determination on something like this based on one shining moment by a player who has done nothing over a 3 year period that’s says he is a viable option at his position!
Good morning Bobber, good post. It would be painful to watch the Hers trot out davis again. I have enjoyed watching Dean’s play thus far. True he has played the box more but has done a respectable job as a deep safety.
Bobber, as always well done. 100% with you on every point you made. 👍
David, Good morning sir. Great article as always. Some quick thoughts on your takes if you will, the whole “we didn’t have a lot of plays” comment from our very own Mr.Rogers” aka Robert ( milk toast) Saleh is interesting. While it points to the obvious as the amount of plays on offense was relatively low, it also points to the not so great QB play. Indigo 394 had some interesting comments here today. A lot of which I agree with. The whole Aaron Rodgers is gonna save Zach Wilson thing is hysterical. Zach’s play yesterday is a continuation of what we have seen since he returned from his injury his rookie season. A keep it simple dummed down overly conservative game plan designed to give him easy throws to build his confidence. It’s his 3rd freak’s season. Good QB play is all about being confident. At this stage in his career If you need to build your confidence your in the wrong profession. The lack of offensive plays is a result of Wilson and Boyle not being trusted to throw the ball down the field. They are being tasked to “just don’t screw it up” job titles. You can’t win football games at this level with that type of offensive strategy. As far as I recall the only two passes Zach has thrown in 3 halves of football that traveled 10 or more yards down field happened in week one vs. Cleveland. Everything is at or behind the line of scrimmage. One the bright side Mekhi looks like the obvious choice at RT. He looked like the guy we saw three years ago. It’s a big if but if he can stay healthy? Ashtyn Davis made a few highlight reel plays. But, does that negate 3 years of basically nothing on defense? I still think Deane gives us better bang for the buck and as Bobber pointed out on AD’s best day Dean dis as much or more minus the so,ash plays. Interesting note, on that one pass block video you posted the guy Becton destroyed was our old friend Hamsa Nasireldeen who we cut a week or so ago. 😂. That must have been a fun post game chat between those two.....😂
Good morning! Agree with your assessments on Zach and Davis. We really do not have a backup QB that meets the standard of mediocrity. Would be upset if Dean doesn’t make the 53 as I think he has played well enough to do so. Not sure he can make it to the practice squad!
We'll certainly see! I hope he is on the team, somehow. I think we, as fans, overrate our own dudes when it comes to what the rest of the league may think. Part of having a good roster, however, is making these tough decisions and having the bottom of your roster pillaged each year.
Certainly a player can see the “light” in his 3rd year but historically Davis’ angles and tackling has been atrocious. It would be painful to have to watch an encore of the prior two years.
Michael R, I’m with you on this one! Fool me once shame on you.... after three years of showing nothing as a position player I’m looking at Saturday night as an aberration! You can’t base a decision on one shinning moment!
I think they're basing it on far more than one game, rather, he does a lot more on the team than just back-up at safety.
Daniel yeah, we’ve all heard all the special teams stuff and it is important. But we all also know guys get hurt. So you need to feel good about who you have to fill in.? Davis has not been very good when asked to fill in. The areas of weakness are well documented so if we know I’m pretty sure the bad guys know too! If we keep 5 there that’s cool. Among the things we tend to under appreciate is the fact that while Davis had his best game as a Jet with 7 tackles Dean actually had 10! 😂
He has done better on special teams
Agreed
To answer your question about negating three years of basically nothing on defense: yes. I'm probably overkilling it with my responses on ole Ashtyn on this thread, but he, actually, has earned his spot on specials, and plays A TON there. Additionally, they play very different roles. It's possible they're fighting for a roster spot, but comparing their play isn't quite an apples to apples comparison. Dean, however, HAS been good and deserves a spot. Keep him on the roster and keep 5 safeties.
what he's done before really doesn't mean anything, imo. It's what the coaches see in him now and his contributions now.
The Jets seemingly play a lot of 3-safety looks. It seems like 5 safeties is needed if that's used often.
I was squarely in the "Davis Sucks!" camp. But he seems to be bigger and better than I remember. And it's not like we have all-pros at the position. ANYONE playing better than the last 2 years of safeties is welcome. If Davis can be part of that equation, keep him.
Mornin' ya'll!!
Has there been a weirder feeling than watching a game end in a 13-6 loss but coming out feeling really good about it? I thought the offensive line was excellent. The protection was great until late when the likes of Chris Glaser, Adam Pankey, Brett Laing, and Grant Hermanns were doing the protecting. Even then, there were some good reps those fellas put on tape. There was a lot to be enthused about and I think we're starting to see what the plan might be for opening day.
Mekhi Becton might be positioning himself to be named the starter at right tackle. He put some great reps on tape and was pretty flawless. He looked healthy and unencumbered. He didn't look like he was doing any thinking, which was nice. He also put some syrup on that pancake, which you love to see.
Max Mitchell put together a pretty damn good performance in the first half at left tackle. There were a couple of instances of him overextending himself, but I loved the rest of what I saw. Those overextensions resulted in him falling off of his block and totally ruined the play, but the rest of his reps showed that those are correctable moments. His pass sets looked solid as hell and he was getting out there and running on the edge.
I think Becton's performance on the right side might mean the coaching staff is trying to play the odds, here. They're best off if Mekhi is starting on opening day, but they're also best off if Duane Brown is, also, starting. The best way to make sure that happens is getting Mekhi to get comfy on the right side and permanently move Max to the left side to be the "just in case" scenario if Duane isn't ready to roll for that first game. It, also, would allow each of our young tackles to stick to one side of the line and get comfortable. It, also, means Turner becomes the swing tackle and sometimes fill-in at guard that he was, probably, signed to be. I, actually, am very encouraged by all of this.
I thought it was also REALLY telling that they gave Joe Tippman the start at left guard, considering we saw his first work at guard earlier in the week at right guard. It's a moot point if he's out for any extended time, but that was interesting that they trusted him to move around that much. That's huge!
Finally, and much less importantly, I think Irwin Charles may have sealed his fate by, AGAIN, hearing footsteps and failing to make a catch as a result. It was a bad day for former Penn State transfers.
Daniel
Agree with your assessment. Becton looked good and since the Jets have pencilled Brown as LT when he returns, the right side is his spot. I must say he looked good manhandling anyone in front of him!
I know, right! Becton looked dominating out there. I know it was against 2nd and 3rd stringers, but the mentality was a breath of fresh air.
Daniel, love the morning ya’ll greeting. Spent my first two college seasons in the south. Definitely a trip! 😂
AVT, Becton and Jeremy Ruckert at TE, Jets run right all day long. Over the moon that Mekhi has embraced the Right Tackle position, seems to be a seamless transition from Left Tackle ( really ?), great athleticism. Could the Offensive line become a Strength ? AVT & Becton duo can make you dream. Ashtyn Davis making the 53 ? Please. Barely played a snap on defense last year, 2.7 against the CAP. Dean had a better camp. The Tampa Bay game , was Ashtyn unleashed, his best game as a Jet, put out some great tape, but not a believer.
JO, totally agree on Davis. Keeping him on this roster based on his one shinning moment would be so Jet like! Saleh has his favorites and I think that’s detrimental to building a solid roster.
I think that happens (coaches keeping a favorite over a better player, or using a favorite player instead of a better player who stays glued to the bench) a lot more in the NFL than we realize. Coaches are human, and their feelings and relationship can't help but color their perspectives and decisions. It takes a very self aware Coach to realize that he's allowing his personal feelings to influence his decisions to the detriment of the team, and then go against those feelings.
Well said! Impossible to argue with your logic on this👍
I’m listening to Bobber, let them fight it out playing against the Giants. Great point on favorites, Salah’s favorable comment on Davis are troubling. Bye the way , I always blamed the Special Team Coach for lobbying for Ashtyn
Well it makes sense that the STs Coach is going to lobby for who he feels are the best STs players. Better players makes him look better and keeps him employed.
Do we fans, perhaps, undervalue special teams play? I understand the thought process regarding folks wanting Trey Dean to make the roster over Ashtyn Davis. Dean is younger, Davis hasn't produced on defense (although, he has on specials), and Davis costs a lot more. I think cost, first and foremost, is a red herring. Aaron Rodgers gave up money so the Jets could put together a competitive team this year. It's also worth noting that we already pay a specials only player in the millions, and we love him for it (Hardee). I think there may be a little bit fan bias in the sense that we, as fans, don't often get to see the innards of the special teams, so we don't appreciate when a guy is important in that respect.
I, actually, think the Jets keep 5 safeties, for what it's worth. Ashtyn and Trey don't even play the same position. Ashtyn is a true free safety and Trey is about as box safety as it gets.
I have to acknowledge the AD has performed well on specials. Also if roster construction permits maybe we keep “5” safeties!
It, almost, makes sense if you squint. Consider they're probably only keeping 4 linebackers!!! Keeping an extra box player probably makes sense.
If Surrat is healthy, I think they're more likely to keep 5 LBs than 5 Safeties. For that matter, they're probably more likely to keep 6 CBs and 4 Safeties, than 5 CBs and 5 Safeties. I could be wrong of course. With their having so many good TEs, and with Brownlee and Gipson, if they plan to keep Kuntz on the roster, that will take away the 5th S or 5th LB or 6th CB. If they keep Bawden, that will take away another player at another position.
That's why it hurts so much that Jarrick Bernard-Converse is gonna wind up on IR and hasn't taken a snap for the Jets. He can play FS or CB and could have saved a roster spot.
Daniel, I agree with all that you say except for keeping 5 safeties and the bit about Ashtyn being a true FS. I don't see any way that the Jets can keep 5 safeties. The numbers are just too tight.
In the past Saleh has said that Ashtyn is more of an in-the-box SS. His speed and athleticism suggest that he would be a FS, but his mental makeup and skills, limit him more to being a SS.
He, certainly, has the physical make-up of a free safety. He's the kind of dude who was so raw coming out that I'm sure Douglas saw him as a bit of a blank canvas. It's possible that the defensive staff has been trying to make that a thing the last year and change. I agree that Surratt is worth a roster spot, but it's possible that they see more value in keeping Dean around to provide big nickel reps than keeping Surratt to not be a primary back-up (because it certainly seems like Sherwood backs up CJ Mosley AND has the role of starting WILL given that they really don't start a 3rd linebacker). The defense has such an intriguing roster construction.
Very good rundown David, as usual. For me the biggest things to talk about after this game are the injuries to Tippmann and Izzy. Not hearing anything from the team other than "tests have to be done and evaluated" makes me lean towards being more serious than not. I guess we will hear something either late today or tomorrow morning and that will be the determining factor on what happens 8 days from today. Becton looked quite good and barring any injury recurrence I feel he will be starting at RT on opening day. Not hearing virtually any word regarding Duane Brown makes me think he will not be ready for the first couple of games. I don't know if they will move Becton back to LT if that's the case, but when there is no news coming out of the team of any sort you just have to wait. I made my opinion on the Dean/Davis deal in a response to Bobber and what's going to happen is going to happen and all the noise about it is moot at this point. I'm really wondering about Corey Davis, he seems to be a nonentity at this point and no real news about him about anything. Either way, it's either going to be Brownlee and Gipson, or just Gipson. I also haven't heard about what's going on with Ruckert's, AVT's and Lawson's injuries. Anybody heard any updates ?
As far as ZW is concerned, the team is committed to him as the backup this season, and that's that. It definitely will be his last shot in my opinion and I highly doubt they will pick up his fifth-year option. What's really scary is The Frightener, Tim Boyle. He shows absolutely nothing of value to me. I'd be afraid to send him in even for a kneel-down, he looked so awful. And his throwing motion seems to be just loft it up there and hope for the best. I guess we'll see what shakes out this week and the final exam comes against the Giants. Now I'm going to go over to GGN and see what nonsense is there today, lol.
I don't know whether moving Becton around is, necessarily, a good idea. I suppose you have to consider the value in, possibly, getting a slight boost at left tackle as opposed to right tackle. It makes more sense to leave him where he is and let him get comfortable with that knee. It isn't like there's actual evidence that left tackle is any more important than right tackle. The blind side was a fun book, but it wasn't trying to tell us that left tackle IS the more important position. It was telling us that teams VIEWED it as the more important position. Defenses change up their pressure packages, move dudes around, and change where pressure is coming from, and offenses are rarely going to leave a guy out on an island completely isolated in man-on-man protection. You might as well start Mitchell or Turner (I prefer Mitchell).
I was just spitballin'. Becton looked very good and let's see how it goes against the Giants. RT might just be the perfect spot for him. I agree with you about Billy Turnstile, if anyone is going to start at LT if Brown isn't ready, it should by Mitchell. Greg Senat has played pretty well, but he's no starter. I personally think they should sign Risner if the deal is right. It might be the best move to make regarding the o-line and would really lock down the guard position and make any potential AVT move to tackle easier to implement.
I would've agreed regarding Risner if we were back in May or June. We're in the last week of training camp, though, and it isn't like they're expecting Duane Brown to be more than a week or two out. Risner would be a guy you have to get up to speed, get into playing shape, work into the offensive line room, work into the starting unit, and get comfortable with all of that in the next two weeks. I'd just as soon take Mitchell or Turner for a week than rolling the dice on all of that uncertainty.
I guess I'm just throwing scat against the wall hoping something would stick, lol.
That's all you can do, honestly. That's, technically, all the front office can do, at some point. Douglas had his hands full last offseason when EVERYBODY on the offensive line got hurt. Thank goodness we no longer have to rely on Conor McDermott anymore.
True, even Billy Turnstile is an improvement on him.
It's not the last week of TC. There are 2 1/2 to 3 weeks left in TC. Of course it would have been better to bring Risner in then, but I'd rather bring him in now than not at all. That said, I don't think the Jets will bring him in.
I don't see them bringing anybody new in. This group is the group. Becton sure seems like he's going to get more 1st team reps at right tackle this week. Hopefully they're ONLY at right tackle.
Agreed! For now RT should be his spot!
Amen, sir!
Daniel, please understand I am not dismissing your thinking on the mental side of playing the QB position. Been there done that. Started playing as an 8 year old! Was blessed to have arm talent and put at the QB position until my Jr year in college. Tore my rotator cuff as a soph so I switched to WR/TE! Coached HS fb for 30 years. Based on my experience there and having a former coaching colleague who ended up as a GM for two NFL teams I think I have a pretty good idea of what the expectations should be for successful QB play at this highest level! I don’t claim to have all the answers but I do know that if it looks like a duck and it quacks like a duck the chances are pretty good that it’s a duck! The Jets just brought in an 🦅 Eagle to fix the mess we made two years ago picking ZW! So duck season is now officially over for me 😂🤣
I truly appreciate the nuanced response and I can, definitely, admit that I got up in my feelings with my post 😅😅
You’re definitely correct that Zach has showcased very little in terms of an ability to cope with the mental rigors of the game. I think there are a number of reasons for that, some of which were out of his control, but everybody deals with those, and if you don’t, you’re outta luck. I think Zach is out of the door at some point in the next year and change. I don’t see him improving enough and think a lot of this is building up his value so they can try to get SOME compensation for him. I think we’re, actually, on the same page here. 😅
Becton had a good outing. Some concern regarding Tippmans’ injury as he was making good progress
Sorry, Daniel, but I totally disagree. IMO it doesn't make any sense at all to put Mitchell or Turner at LT. That's asking (begging, actually) to get Rodgers seriously injured and on IR for much, if not the rest, of the season. Becton is showing that he's comfortable with the knee now. The difference between Becton and Turner or Mitchell at LT isn't "slight." There's a huge difference between Becton's level of play and what we have seen from Turner and Mitchell so far. If Brown isn't ready to go, then by all means, Becton should move back to LT. As you know, he's been taking snaps there until this week, so he would have no problems going back to LT. They can then use Turner at RT or move AVT to RT until Brown is ready to go, then they can move Becton back to RT and AVT back to RG. Mitchell is not ready to start or play in the NFL imo. He should be glued to the bench.
You can't be serious with that LT isn't more important than RT statement! IMO that is utter nonsense. Protecting the QB's blind side is of much greater importance in keeping the QB healthy and able to play without worrying about getting crushed from behind. It enables the QB to relax and play when he trusts that his blindside is well protected. Yes, defenses change and send their best pass rushers against the RT at times, but the QB can see that and adjust and there are things that the OC can do to compensate for that. QBs don't have eyes in the back of their heads, and they need to know that their blindside is safe.
Craig, there’s one problem with you thinking on this. It’s the trust factor! We all know Becton is the most talented player on our o-line. But availability is your best availability! RS would be insane to totally trust him! I hope he earns his way on the field! No question he’s our best option.
Ron, Saleh has admitted that he hasn't trusted Becton in a long time. Becton should have earned his trust this TC. He is healthy, he is strong, and he is dominating the LOS. He IS available. Not starting Becton is a fear-based move. That's what's behind the lack of trust. Little is ever gained by making decisions based on fear. IMO it makes zero sense to start an inferior player knowing that the team will not play as well with that player in the starting lineup. You go with your best players, and if Becton winds up getting hurt again at some point, then at least you've gotten great play from him up until that point, and then you make the change. Sure, there would be an adjustment at that point, but the difference between Becton starting and Mitchell or Turner starting could be several more wins than they would have had with Mitchell or Turner starting. That could be the difference between making the playoffs and not making the playoffs. Saleh makes too many decisions based on his personal feelings about players. IMO Becton has done enough already to earn his way onto the field and to earn Saleh's trust.
I think your anti-Saleh bias is shining through, buddy. There's zero evidence he feels some sort of way, personally, about Mekhi Becton. Give that a rest. Becton will probably wind up starting at some point. That sort of looks like it has been the plan the whole time. There is WAY more going on behind the scenes than you're making it out to be.
Daniel, I have no bias against Saleh. I like him and want to trust him, but it's the words that come out of his mouth and the decisions that he has made that I think are wrong, that causes a degree of distrust. We all see what we want to see. Perhaps I'm seeing things you aren't because you are a former coach and are biased in Saleh's favor or maybe you did some of the same things that I've said I don't like.
I'm sorry, but I'm not giving anything a rest just because you disagree, and it's not your place to tell me what or how to think or post. I think there's plenty of evidence that Saleh allows his personal feelings about players to influence his decisions. He doesn't have to be necessarily biased against Becton, it could just be that he is biased for Mitchell. It isn't just the Becton situation that makes me think that Saleh allows his feelings to get in the way with personnel decisions. There's A. Davis. Maybe C. Davis. Of course there is probably more going on behind the scenes than we know. We only know what they allow us to know, what leaks out, or when they slip up and admit something in a press conference. I'm not making anything out about what goes on behind the scenes. That's your interpretation.
He's, without a doubt, the most talented player on the offensive line. He might be the most talented guy on either side of the line, defense or offense. You're very right, though....the talent has never been his issue. It's been one of the best kinds of ability: AVAILability.
Mitchell looked good on Saturday. Not sure what game you were watching. Moving guys around is the way you wind up with miscommunication. And I'm very serious. There is literally zero truth to the nonsense about left tackles being more important than right tackles because of handedness. That isn't remotely how the position is played or coached and coaches do not take that into account. I'm actually telling you this from relatively recent experience. It isn't a thing.
Sorry, but I think you are overstating things. I know that that the gap has closed between the two, but don't think it has closed entirely, at least not in the minds of QBs. I'm not a betting man, but if I were, I'd bet you that any NFL QB would tell you that there is a difference and that it matters to them. I don't care what coaches say. They aren't always right. We've seen more than our share of coaches with cockamamie ideas on the Jets. For southpaw QBs, the RT is the more important position. If the two were equal, Wirfs wouldn't be getting moved from RT to LT. That puts the lie to your theory.
I checked out the Buccaneers depth chart and the reasoning behind his move. The guy they wanted at right tackle, Luke Goedeke played ONLY right tackle at Central Michigan and they spent a 2nd rounder on him. I imagine they felt more comfortable asking the veteran, in Wirfs, to make the move to a different side of the line. That, honestly, falls in line with some of what we're dealing with here. It's a sliding scale, of course. They don't want to ask Duane Brown to move, but they will ask Mekhi, Max, and Billy to move. It's all in the details. Duane has played every single snap for the last 16 years (probably more....he probably started a bunch in college) at left tackle, Billy has played all over the place, Mekhi had been moved around the previous season and there's definitely an explicit plan in place for how they're handling him, and Max played on both sides in college. There was less to unlearn for the three younger guys.
I understand that some of the logic works. And I understand that there are some anecdotes that can prove the rule. What I'm telling you, however, is that it is, yes, overstated, and that quarterbacks just aren't fretting whether they have a better right tackle or left tackle. The whole conceit of left tackle being more important isn't borne out by how offenses or defenses are called. It just doesn't work that way.
I agree! Keep Becton either left or right but let him have stability and pray for durability. So far so good!
Mike, it remains to be seen what happens with Zach. I agree that they won't agree to the original 5th year that he was due, as that's too much money for him to be the backup QB. They may seek to get him to sign an extension that is incentive-laden and has escalators built in for performance and number of games played that would increase the length and value of the contract. IMO it would be in both his and the team's best interests to stay. He would continue developing under Rodgers and Hackett, and feeling more and more comfortable in the WCO. In addition he already has chemistry with his receivers and the CS. The Jets aren't going to be in a position to draft another FQB prospect for a number of years, and the chance of their getting another veteran QB like Rodgers are slim and none. They'd be forced to go with journeyman jags at QB, and wouldn't have much of a chance of going anywhere in the playoffs. If he develops, the way I think he will, Zach will give them the best chance of continued success and getting high level QB play. Rodgers thinks so as well.
Many fans don't realize how complex and difficult the WCO is for QBs. I think it is probably the most difficult for QBs. It has so many requirements of the QB. I've read that it takes at least 3 years to really learn the scheme, and that's if one has good coaching. We know that Zach had bad coaching his 1st two seasons, and that's part of the reason he struggled so.
We all obsess about roster construction but in the end the team decides. I do worry in the event of injury to AR, our backups don’t even meet the definition of mediocre!
I disagree. Zach is better than all you naysayers and doom and gloomers regarding Zach think he is.
Craig, I give you credit for your loyalty but as you can by the comments here obviously most Jet fans have seen enough of Zach to know he’s not a viable option at this time! The Jets are trying to promote him as an option but they are killing any shot he has by not allowing him to actually show what he can ( or can’t do?) David has discussed his struggles under pressure ad nauseam! The fact he’s been the league’s lowest rated QB his first two seasons is literally unprecedented! It’s never happened in league history.
Ron, there are first times for everything. I could care less what most Jets fans think. Most Jets fans are impatient, and have little understanding of what it is like to play in the NFL, what it takes to make wholesale changes in one's technique and mental approach to the game, and the difference that coaching can make. I don't expect that you or anyone will change his mind, but I'm going to share a post (if it works) that I found on another Jets football site last night that is excellent in showing one very valid reason Zach has struggled so badly the last two seasons.
I think at the tender age of 71 I have a pretty idea of what Zach’s issues have been so thanks but no thanks. I have played the game and have extensive experience as a coach. The Zach fan has an endless line of reasons or excuses for Zach’s failings and frankly the only one that holds water is David’s post from a few months ago about his inability to throw under pressure. The just breaks down under duress. The happy feet put him in poor throwing position which affects his accuracy and the timing in the play. He misses his windows dancing around. He’s not the first NFL QB to have this problem. Honestly I can’t think of one that ever fixed it?
He is going to be the backup QB this year. Ultimately the proof is in the pudding. If he gets to play we will be able to assess if he has made any progress. He has arm talent but his feel for the game and what is between the ears matters as well. Progress in those areas will determine his success… half empty or half full?
Whether it's half empty or half full depends upon the perspective of the viewer, and in general, people see what they want to see, especially if they have a bias one way or the other. For those who have decided that Zach is a bust and never can become a good QB, all they see are his mistakes. They don't see any growth or improvement. In a very real sense, they don't want to see it, because that goes against their agenda, and many, if not most fans would rather be right than be wrong so they look more knowledgeable. I only want what's best for the team, and am all too happy to admit when I am wrong. None of us are experts, and our egos get too much involved.
I view ZW via the sum of his prior performances. Can he improve, of coarse. Will he improve to the extent that he can become a competent starting QB? That story has not been written. Frankly as the Jets invested a number 2 pick on him, I would prefer and would be ecstatic if he does succeed as opposed to being a work of fiction.
I was at the game Saturday night. Why was it after about a quarter and a 1/2 did it feel like the same old Jets. I hated losing to Todd Bowles and looking at the preseason standings with the Jets in the normal residence - last place.
Three games in and there are wayyyy too many penalties. It never changes on a Saleh coached team for some reason. It wasnt how many they got called for (and they always take a ton) its when they occured. Then the turnovers. I did not see anything glaring by whatever mongrel combinatuon of offensice linemen were out there. (I get they looking to solidify the roster).
The defense seemed to be in a bend dont break mode but even with the pass rush a 2nd rate QB was picking up yards and 1st downs keeping the Jets offense on the bench more of the night. I really wish they had signed Bridgewater as 'we' are in toruble in Rogers goes down. I was never for Boyle being even the 3rd string.
Oh ya - we didnt make it through the preseason with out a key injury - in this case two of them. Assume the worse as there has been no updates at all. Th einfamous Brown injury that never goes away means going into week 1 there will be a offensive line - again that never played together. Good news is the Bills seem to have thier own issues on offense line.
I think I'm becoming the Pollyanna on this thread. I'm not all that worked up with most of the penalties given the context. Two were Zach Kuntz holding, and we understand that the dude is still learning how to block. That isn't one of those "these guys are undisciplined" penalties. Same goes for one of Langford's penalties. The one I'd be concerned with was Langford going head hunting on his other penalty. There weren't a bunch of false starts, delay of games, roughing the passer/unnecessary roughness (aside from Langford's aforementioned) penalties. I would, however, not be surprised to see some penalties like that late in a preseason game, given that most of the guys playing are 3rd and 4th stringers who know very little of the scheme and are playing for a spot. Things get sloppy and people get hurt. The "Saleh is coddling" narrative is kind of old and doesn't ring true.
I didnt say he is coddling i am saying a "Saleh coached team is laced with penalty taking - be it the 1.s, 2's 3s, 4s - Agree=ts preseason but regular season with different players and its always a ton of penanlities -
We might have been watching different teams. The types of penalties point is still valid, however. Are you suggesting that they're an undisciplined team? Are you suggesting that they're poorly coached? Is it an offensive thing? Is it a defensive thing? Is it technique? Is it corners getting too grabby? Is it defensive players getting lots of unnecessary roughness calls? Or are we, perhaps, talking about delay of game penalties? False starts? Holding? Are you differentiating between all of this? And I understand that you didn't explicitly say, verbatim, that Saleh is coddling players. That is the narrative, though. I think that narrative is invented out of whole cloth by a fanbase that expects the worst and turns on it's own with alarming speed.
no no no I think Saleh is one of the best coaches the Jets have ever had and im a 55 year fan. Not sure where that narrative is coming from and i never heard it to be honest with you. As a season ticket holder and being at the games - i shouldn't have to wait 3 seconds to celebrate a good play or look back on the field for a flag. I am not differentiating anything - I'm saying on a 45 man roster (now its 90) its thru the whole team no matter the position, group, whatever. My first point written is exactly what you just said: I was giong into the season NOT excpecting the worse - for once. It sure "felt" like with the injuries and the penalties it will be the worse as per usual. I dont really know but after all these years can something change please.
I totally feel that feeling of waiting for the team to finally stop making the same mistakes. That's why I've been so happy to have Saleh and Douglas around. I never actually liked Rex Ryan. The guy was a huge asshole and was almost assuredly trying to cover some of own perceived self-perception issues with all of the bravado. Gase was, just, the worst. Then they go and sign that huge dickhead Gregg Williams, and it was just SOOOOOO hard to root for those teams with those guys in charge. Finally, they bring in a coach who is positive, likeable, and seems competent. Those Gase/Williams years sucked something fierce.
did you live through Kotite LOL - I have gone twice in my life with Gase and Kotite
Great newsletter today, David! I love everything about it, from the content to the layout!
I really hope that Tippman's and Abanikanda's injuries are minor and won't be season-ending!!!!! We really need both of them to play this season. Hopefully, they won't miss much time, and hopefully AVT, Tomlinson, and Brown will all be back this week, and Saleh will wise up, and move Becton up to taking reps with the 1s so our starting OL can start working together!
I'm so excited for Becton, and in turn for the Jets, because Becton is going to make our OL a lot better. I'm also very happy for him that he has the chance to silence the NY media and all the Jets fans who were on his case and wanting him gone. I hope he has an All Pro season, and the Jets sign him to a long-term contract.
You gotta love our pass rush, and we know our secondary is going to be tight and even better with Tony Adams back there.
The only area where there is a big question mark is the middle of the field where LBs will have to cover TEs and RBs. Hopefully Sherwood can get it done, or if Surratt makes the roster, he can. If so, we could definitely challenge Dallas for the #1 D this season.
Zach is making definite progress, and his comments that you shared in the Post-Game Quotes help me to understand better what's been going on with Zach. There are two of them. One, by his own admission, he is hard on himself. He expects himself to play better, and he has been unable to move on from a bad play. That causes a player to think too much, makes them uptight, and increases the likelihood that they will repeat that mistake or make another mistake. In addition, I have read that MLF was very negative and critical in how he handled players. If that's true, it's no wonder Zach lost his confidence and played so badly last season. Zach needed someone like Hackett, who is upbeat and positive, to help him move on from his mistakes and to have fun, and not beat himself up for mistakes. He also need Rodgers tips on fundamentals and the nuances of playing the QB position in the WCO.
The second insight is that for the last two seasons Zach has evidently been trying to run an offense that he really didn't understand why they were doing things, what the goal was for certain plays. It's no wonder he didn't show command of the offense and struggled, on top of the other reasons. That's the OC's and QB Coach's job is to communicate those things to the QB. It's not just a matter of "Do this how and when I tell you, you don't need to understand why." MLF is even a bigger moron than I already thought he was. His big brother needs to get a hold of him and teach him how to be a coach.
I think those two things coming to light explain why Zach struggled so, was so inconsistent, and why he is not improving pretty quickly. It gives me even greater confidence that is why that JD and Saleh haven't given up on him, and that he is still in the Jets' plans long term.
I don't see the Jets getting rid of Corey Davis to keep Brownlee or Gipson. That would be a very questionable, risky, and perhaps stupid move in a season where they have SB aspirations. Davis is an experienced player, a quality player, and great scheme fit. He helps both our passing and rushing attacks. It might be one thing to trade or cut him if we needed the cap space or if we had a 2nd or 3rd round WR pick that we needed to make room for, but it's quite another to do that for a UDFA who could wind up being another David Clowney. While I would hate to lose Brownlee or Gipson, I don't see any way we can keep both, and we may not even be able to keep one of them.
I'm sorry, CGVet, but it definitely looks like A. Davis is still going to be on the roster, and if Saturday night's game is any indication, that might not be a bad thing. Evidently, he's very good on STs, and he looked good on the field on D.
I don't see any way that Kuntz can or should make the roster. If another team claims him off waivers, then so be it. He is not ready to play in the NFL. He has a ton of potential, but you can't use a precious roster spot on a player who only has potential and won't be able to contribute this season over another player who is already playing in a consistent, reliable solid fashion.
I hope that Bam and Dye can make it to the PS and that Bawden will join them there.
You're spot on with Zach and the mental stuff he's working through. I really like Hackett. I was a little unsure of him, but I think that was more tied into my negativity about Aaron Rodgers than anything. He seems like this relentlessly upbeat fella that totally vibes with Saleh, and is a great counterpoint to Ulbrich. Having Aaron Rodgers in the room doesn't suck, either.
You've got in right regarding Corey Davis. He's going to be important at some point this season, whether it is excellent run blocking, a chance big play, or helping our younger fellas with the trials and tribulations of acclimating to the league. He's valuable and Rodgers took that pay cut for a reason.
Kuntz just does not look like a football player, yet. Guys have transformed before, of course. It's concerning that when he runs, he doesn't look as athletic as he's supposed to be. It's also concerning that he looks afraid of contact. He could've used the experience of staying at Penn State and working his way into playing time.
Bam and Dye made some big ole mistakes on Saturday night. Hopefully one or both can make it to the practice squad.
Daniel Mcsparin, yeah, sorry but I’m not buying any of the mental stuff with Zach’s. It’s year three and we’re still talking about him like he’s a rookie? All the other like, dislike stuff aside none of this matters. With Rodgers back next season and very likely in 2025 Zach has no future here! Any player with any ambition or pride is not gonna want to spend the next three years appreciating for Aaron Rodgers. Even if JD wanted to pick up his 20 million option it would be financially impossible! My guess is he will move on next offseason! I believe that’s in his best interests and that JD Will happily agree!
I agree that he probably doesn't have a future on the Jets. That doesn't make the mental process any less true. Football is an extremely mental game, and if you truly don't think that building up confidence again matters, I'm not sure what to tell you. It's a FACT of the game. When was the last time you played competitive football? Coached it? Ruined confidence is real, and it requires work to come back from it. If your argument is that they just need to cut bait and move on, there's probably a discussion around that. He's an asset that they invested lots of resources in, so it makes sense that they'd try to fix the mistakes they made. Please, engage with the actual conversation, dude.
I just can't stand ZW: What's with all the talk about the importance of his being Happy and Smiling.
He makes Mims (RIP) seem a genius. That run was almost identical to last years pre-season injury inducing scamp. On a drop back his feet are tapping faster than Sammy Davis Junior. Less smiling more stepping up into the pocket! How many times have you seen him on the bench with team mates? When we he release faster and lead his receiver? And that smirk, that smirk!
I'm a little bit less offended about him getting his mind right. I think that's part of him regaining his confidence and rebuilding his skillset. You are correct, however, in pointing out that he isn't stepping up into the pocket. I saw at least one play where a good starter steps up into the crease of the pocket when he's pressured. Zach did the same falling away, back-foot throw that has been his Achilles Heel. He needs to fix that, because protection was excellent on Saturday.
Daniel, please, stop with this whole confidence stuff. Playing the QB position is an Alpha requirement! At this stage in his career ( year 3) if he needs a pep talk or special catering he’s done! I have never heard of an NFL QB overcoming two horrendous seasons like Wilson has had! He’s had the benefit of far more surrounding talent and much better coaching and yet his numbers are far worse than his predecessors! My biggest regret with the Wilson pick is we could hav picked Penea Sewell, Kyle Pitts or Jamar Chase! Could have rolled with Sam and figured it out from there!
My guy; I agree that picking him was a mistake. I would've preferred Sewell. You're dismissing the very real loss of confidence, however, and the need to build it back. You don't need to try so hard to shit all over the guy to make your point that the pick didn't work out. In addition to that, you are, actually, flat out wrong that "this confidence stuff" isn't real. It's a real thing in athletics, regardless of the sport.
It wasn't on the two plays where he ran. On both of those the pocket was collapsing and he couldn't step up. I think there was one other throw where he couldn't step up either, but may be mistaken about that.
There was one where the pocket started to collapse and Zach kept drifting back, but the offensive line and the running back wound up cleaning it up. It was a half slide where the running back slotted right into the right side A gap and, technically, picked up the pressure, a bit. It looked like the running back was going to get pushed back into Zach but Schweitzer came in and cleaned up the pocket, providing a nice little place for him to step up into. It's the kind of thing where a seasoned and GOOD QB will stay calm and step up. That asshat Tom Brady would've done it. Rodgers would've, too.
I think Zach will once he is feeling more comfortable and confident. Growth isn't always linear, and it takes time. Zach obviously didn't get very good coaching at BYU or his first two seasons with the Jets. He has a ton of talent, but he is learning how to play QB in the NFL and in a very complex, rigid offense in terms of what the QB must do. That is all new to him. With his desire to learn and be as great as he can be, I have to believe that he will get there.
Very true. You have to experience the pressure to be able to acclimate to it.
So today was an awesome day on this page! My feeling is our boy DWH is becoming a rock star. There are 89 comments on todays post. That’s amazing. The best part of this is there zero posts that have any vitriol or harsh language. That not something we should we should stuff off. It’s is not the norm on most Jet pages. It speaks to the maturity and civility on David’s page!